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KHRG #98-05 Part 5/7 (Dooplaya)
- Subject: KHRG #98-05 Part 5/7 (Dooplaya)
- From: strider@xxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Tue, 30 Jun 1998 21:36:00
STRENGTHENING THE GRIP ON DOOPLAYA
Developments in the SPDC Occupation of Dooplaya District
An Independent Report by the Karen Human Rights Group
June 10, 1998 / KHRG #98-05
[Some details blanked out or omitted for Internet distribution.]
*** PART 5 OF 7 - SEE OTHER POSTINGS FOR OTHER PARTS OF THIS REPORT ***
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#4.
NAME: "Pa Bway Htoo" SEX: M AGE: 44 Karen Dta La Ku farmer
FAMILY: Married, 7 children
ADDRESS: On the Burma-Thai border by Dooplaya District INTERVIEWED:
23/3/98
["Pa Bway Htoo" is a Dta La Ku village elder who often has to negotiate
with all sides in the conflict.]
I will explain to you the things that have happened in the past, about KNU
and SLORC over time through the years. These things give problems to
the villagers. The villagers have to suffer between KNU and SLORC,
many kinds of difficult things. Sometimes SLORC or KNU groups do
what their leaders order them to do but sometimes they do not do as their
leaders order, so the people who live near the border have had to suffer
difficulties many times. As for me, I live along the border so I have to
see
and hear these problems. It makes me sad and I have pity on the people
who have to suffer these problems. I want to tell about what happened
first, when the SLORC came. At that time, we were near the border and
many people from many villages such as Kwih Kler, Meh Naw Dah Hta,
Lay Th'Ray, Tee Po Khaw, Maw, Tee Ler Baw, Kay Ghaw, Heh Kyaw
Kwa and Meh Ger ran away to escape from the dangerous bullets and
shells exchanged between KNU and SLORC. The villagers were afraid
and ran away because they could not stand it. Some people arrived in Noh
Po [refugee camp] but the people who were very close to the border did
not go, because they wanted to make peace, to live in their own villages to
farm and to earn their living in their own country. When there will be
peace in their country, at that time we will go to visit them.
I am the village headman from xxxx and I have a lot of pity for the people
when I see that they have to suffer these problems. So I went to visit the
Second in Command of #44 [Light Infantry Division; actually just the 2nd
in command of the 44 Division troops in that area] named Aung Kyaw
Nyunt; the name of their Colonel is Than Lwin. They welcomed us nicely
and told me, "Tell the people who fled to Thailand to come back and farm
their fields in their own villages". Then I went to Kwih Lat Der and held
a
meeting there with the headmen and the people, and told them what I had
been told. The people who heard that were satisfied and happy, so they
went back to their own villages. The people who'd fled on foot went back
on foot, and the people who had fled on bullock carts went back with their
bullock carts and their cattle. The people who had some possessions hired
cars and went back with warm hearts and lived in their villages happily.
The time passed by and #44 went back, then #22 [Light Infantry Division]
and #356 [Light Infantry Battalion] came instead. Their leaders forced
the people to work for them. The labour was not so hard, but the worst
thing was that they arrested people and forced them to look for weapons
after they had tied them up. Then they interrogated the frightened people.
Some people were not what the soldiers accused them of, but they were
very afraid and the soldiers forced them to confess anyway, and then they
were into big problems until they couldn't stand it. The soldiers
persecuted them in many ways, and they forced people to give their
livestock, to sell them their cattle and buffaloes and to give taxes to
them.
The people had to give the taxes but they didn't really know to whom they
should give them. If they gave them to one man, another man arrested
them.
So, we were living near the border and we were sad to hear about them.
During the #356 time they persecuted the people and many people were
hurt. The name of the #356 Battalion Commander was Ohn Lwin and the
commanders who raped and persecuted many people were Htoo Kya and
A'Saw Myo Htet. First Htoo Kya was living in Kwih Lat Der and Yaw
K'Daw, then he went to live in Lay Th'Ray and persecuted a lot of people.
Once he met a man who was a fool [mentally handicapped] and he asked
the man, "Do you have a weapon? Have you seen the place where the
KNU hides their weapons?" Then the fool answered, "Yes, I saw". Htoo
Kya asked, "Where was it?", and the man answered, "Up on the rock" [it
was a small limestone cliff]. After a while he saw a farmer coming back
from his farm and he told commander Htoo Kya, "I can't climb up that
rock, but that man can climb up the rock because he was the one who put
the weapons up there, so he knows better than I do". Then Htoo Kya
captured the farmer and forced him to seek the weapons up on the rock.
But he didn't know and he couldn't find anything, so Htoo Kya kicked him
off the rock and he fell. His name was Saw Chit Heh. They killed him, he
was from Lay Th'Ray village.
Another man named Saw Ku climbed up a dogfruit tree to get some
dogfruit. Unfortunately he fell and broke his leg. He went to a
traditional
healer named Maung Yo Yeh. Maung Yo Yeh cured the broken leg with
holy oil over which mantras had been recited. The Burmese heard about
it, and they said "This nga pway ['ringworm', i.e. KNLA] soldier came
back from the frontline battle and that traditional healer cured him". I
testified that what they said was not true, because there was no battle
wound on Saw Ku's leg. It really was broken by falling from the tree.
Then they threatened the village headman that they would kill him because
he had allowed a nga pway soldier to be cured. They said if the headman
didn't want to die he must give them 50,000 kyats. The headman was
afraid of them but he couldn't do anything. He asked them to go and see
the place where Saw Ku had fallen down but they wouldn't go. He asked
them to go and look at the leg of Saw Ku but they wouldn't go. They just
asked for money. So the villagers helped him by collecting 50,000 kyats,
and they gave that money to Htoo Kya. When the Burmese got 50,000
kyats they went away and stopped making problems for him.
So, the civil servants are working at politics. The Burmese say that they
must rule over people in their country and that what they are doing is for
the people in their country. The Thais also say the same, and if we look
carefully we see that they rule over their people and persecute them
terribly also. So we who live on the border are very sad to see the people
on both sides suffering terrible things.
Afterwards #61 [Infantry Battalion] came, and they forced the people to
work very hard but the people tried to do it anyway. They forced the
people to carry cement from Ber Kler to Htee Hta Baw [over 20 km/12
miles as the crow flies, much farther on land], at night time in the rainy
season when the river was flooded. So the people were in trouble. Some
came back ill. Some coughed up blood, and some were vomitting with
blood. Some had wounds on their backs and others had wounds on their
sides. We had pity on them when we saw them. Before they started
carrying some people asked the soldiers, "It's too heavy, we can't carry
this. Will we be able to carry this?" Then the soldiers kicked them and
said, "Why do you ask before carrying?" Before they crossed the river
some people asked, "If we cross the river will the cement get wet?" Then
the soldiers slapped their faces and said, "Why do you ask before you cross
the river?" Then when the people crossed the river and the cement got wet
they kicked them and hit them again and said, "Don't you know that the
cement will be destroyed and we can't use it if it gets wet?" They hurt
many people that time. The commander who forced the people to carry
cement is Kyay Lay Oo. He abused many people at that time.
So people saw that the Burmese all behave differently. Each one of them
works differently and has different rules. If we look for the source we
see
that they all get their orders from the same leaders, but they come and
order the people around differently. The people couldn't stand it anymore
so they fled for the second time. The people from Kwih Kler, Meh
Tharaw Hta, Pu Chit Mu, Ter Wah Law, Lay Th'Ray, and Tee Po Khaw all
fled because the Burmese persecuted those people, forced them to work as
forced labourers and to be porters. We had pity on those people when we
saw them in such a bad situation. After that there were more people from
faraway places who fled here, because they were in a terrible situation
too.
We had not seen them before, because they lived far from us. We didn't
know what kind of problems they'd had to suffer. But we knew that they
were in a very bad situation because they came from many villages, such
as Yah Ther Hta, Noh Maw Po, Waw Lu, Klaw Day, Lay Po Hta, Na Htee
Kloh, and from many other villages that we didn't even know the names
of! Also Meh Dter, Meh Ku, Htee Ka Bprah, Toh Doh Neh, many
villages. Some fled up here to live with us, and some fled onward to other
places too. They fled into Thailand but they couldn't get into Noh Po
refugee camp. They were coming from faraway places, and people let
them stay along the pathways. It was very hard for them to get food. They
were in poverty. So we looked at them and had pity on them, and we were
very disappointed with the people who rule over the population. When
they lived in Burma the Burmese persecuted them. When they went to
stay in Thailand, the Thai didn't love them either. We saw the Thais push
them up and down and hit them until they were wounded. They ran to
Baw Ner Hta, some had no food to eat nor good water to drink, so they
drank dirty water and got diarrhoea, and then many people died of
diarrhoea on the mountainsides. This was a big problem that we couldn't
solve. Then the Burmese and Thais wanted the people to go back to
Burma. The people didn't dare to go back because they were too worried
that the Burmese would harm them, but the Thais said they won't allow
them to live in Thailand anymore. It is a very big problem.
Just after Kyay Lay Oo forced people to carry cement, the Monk of
Myaing Gyi Ngu [U Thuzana, founder and leader of the DKBA] sent some
DKBA people to us and they told us that if we are vegetarians and do
everything the monk [Thuzana] orders, the Burmese won't come to our
village to harm us again. They said, "If the villagers follow the plan of
the
Myaing Gyi Ngu monk they will be free from forced labour and portering
and the Burmese will not hit them or kill them anymore". The villagers
felt very happy to hear that. Everyone decided to become DKBA and they
started to eat as vegetarians, but after a few days the DKBA people
disappeared. They went back secretly without saying goodbye to anybody.
When they first came the villagers were very happy to hear what they
said, but those people left the villagers hopeless when they went back
secretly. [They were ordered back to Pa'an District by the SPDC, to be
replaced by KPA.]
After that the KPA came and told the villagers, "If you put your name on
the KPA list the Burmese won't force you to do forced labour and
portering. Now we must live in peace. But if you don't put your name on
the KPA list the Burmese will force you to do forced labour and
portering". Because after all, the Burmese force people to work harder
than people can, not as parents ask their children to work. If they forced
us to work as parents ask their children to work, we could try to bear it.
We know that people who do politics must force the public to work, but
the Burmese force the people to work harder than the law, it's not just.
So
the villagers want to be free from this forced labour and portering, and
they agreed to become KPA if they would be free from forced labour.
But when we held a meeting to talk about becoming KPA, the KPA came
and ordered us to become soldiers. They said that KPA soldiers would not
need to go to other places, that they could stay at home [based in their
home villages]. Then some people from Kwih Kler and Meh Naw Dah
Hta joined the KPA army. But the KPA never kept those people in their
own homes, they sent them away to other villages. And now we've got a
message that they tried to escape from the army! So then we couldn't
decide anything about whether to become KPA or not, and we still don't
know how to solve that problem for the people. We hope that the
Burmese will love their children as our families love their villages and
will try to solve these problems for the people, but when the people came
up here the Burmese asked the Thais to drive them back, and when they
went back the Burmese persecuted them. So we are worried. The people
are good, but when people can't stand up and have to suffer, they can
become bad.
Last month they gathered the people and divided them into two groups.
One group was to be a people's army [i.e. regular KPA] and the other
group was to be village defenders who would be sentries in each village.
They took their training in Kwih Kalay and the leader told them that they
could stay in their own houses after the training, but after they finished
they were not allowed to stay in their own homes. There were 50 of them
in that training. The leader sent them from Kyaikdon to Kya In Seik Gyi,
so then they knew that their leader did differently than what he said and
many of them tried to escape. They ran away and hid themselves, they
didn't want to go to other villages, they couldn't agree with their leader
because he'd said they wouldn't have to leave their homes. We don't know
how to help the people who are in this trouble now. Many people will flee
here, many people have already fled from Thailand back to Burma because
the Thais gave them no security and they were afraid, and I am afraid that
they will have to face hunger. They won't have a chance to make their
farms, and maybe some will become robbers. It is just like the period
when the Japanese and the English were fighting each other. A lot of
hunger and robbery happened during that time. The best thing is that now
the English are taking care of the refugee camps, but now the Thais won't
allow the new people who flee to go to the refugee camps. When they go
back to Burma the Burmese don't feed them either, so they are caught in
the middle and hungry. I'm worried that they will kill each other in the
fight for food, so I hope the rulers of the world will look and see this
happening, meet with the SPDC and solve this problem.
If they don't do it, we who live on the border must be afraid. We are
afraid
both of the people who are being driven and of those who drive them, so I
hope that the big men of the English and the Thais will meet with each
other and think about how to take care of these people in a terrible
situation. If the politicians are selfish then it will only become worse
for
these people.
Q: Are the KPA still saying that the Dta La Ku people must become
soldiers?
A: Last month they were still saying that, but they haven't said anything
this month. I will tell you: Many Dta La Ku fled to Thailand but they
stayed together near here, not at the refugee camp. They fled because the
Burmese forced them to do labour and portering. They fled from #44 and
#356, then they went back again but #61 came and forced them to carry
heavy things so they fled again. Then the DKBA came and told them if
they became DKBA they would be free from harm by the SLORC, so they
waited for the DKBA's help. But the DKBA disappeared. Then the KPA
appeared and ordered the Dta La Ku to become soldiers, but the people
didn't want to carry weapons because they knew that even if they didn't use
them to shoot at others, those others would shoot at them.
So when we had the New Year festival, many of us headmen held a
meeting and we talked about how we must be faithful to our religion and
follow the rules of our religion. That is easy to tell people, but not so
easy
to do because we are a minority who live among other peoples. We Dta
La Ku must not drink or touch alcohol, we must not eat or touch pork, and
we must not rear pigs. But if we live among the Burmese we cannot do as
our rules say, and that makes us sad. If the Burmese order us to go and
find alcohol and bring it to them we must do it because we are afraid of
them. While we are portering for the Burmese we do not dare say
anything against them when they put sausage or ham or the head of a pig
in our carrying basket. So how can we live as our religion dictates? Not
only that, now they say we must carry guns. Even though we know that
the words of our [Dta La Ku] leaders are right, we cannot observe them if
we live among other people. So we headmen talked about that, and at last
we decided that we would go to the Burmese leaders and ask them to give
the Dta La Ku people a chance to live all together in Taung Ka Lay and
Kwih Kler, in Burma but near the border, not on the Thai side. I think the
Burmese will allow it. We will do nothing against them. If they come to
our place or pass through it we hope that they will not persecute us, but
if
they do persecute us then we will run away again. Not only the people
from Taung Ka Lay will flee, the people from other places will flee also.
I
think the Burmese will agree with us because the place we have chosen is
near our religious centre and it will be easy for us to go to our
festivals. If
we live further away and we need to go to a festival we must pass many
armies; if the Burmese SPDC allow us to go, maybe the DKBA will not
allow us, if the DKBA allow us then maybe the KPA will not allow us, or
if the KPA allow us then maybe the KNU will not allow us. Now many of
our headmen have gone to the Burmese leaders to ask them. If the
Burmese love us and do not want our religion to be destroyed, they ought
to give us what we need.
When we look at KNU soldiers, their commander orders them to go to the
villages and to help the villagers, to take care of them because the SLORC
harms them. But some KNU soldiers enter the villages and order the
villagers to give money, 10,000 or 20,000 Kyats, and they say that if the
villagers don't give the money then they will shoot at the Burmese around
the village. So the people are afraid and try to give it to them, even if
they
don't have enough money for themselves. They must give to KNU, to
SLORC, to KPA and to DKBA too. The people have hard lives because
they have to give money to many groups even though they don't have
enough food for themselves. That is the big problem for them. If you go
and ask anybody about what they have to suffer, they will tell you the
same. Now there are a lot of KNLA in Burma. Sometimes they disturb us
when we go to our festivals, they say to us, "Do not go or I will shoot
you". Sometimes the villagers want to sell their wooden houses to buy
rice and move to Kwih Lat Der or Taung Ka Lay, and the KNLA ask those
villagers for half the price of their house; for example if we sell our
house
and get 20,000 kyats we must give 10,000 kyats to the KNLA. They tell
us, "If you don't want to give half the price of your house then you must
not sell it". So now our Dta La Ku people need to live in Kwih Lat Der
and Taung Ka Lay and just to make our farms peacefully. We won't live
in Thailand. Dta La Ku people who live on the Thai side have no chance
to do farming, so if they stay for a long time they will have no food.
On March 20th 1998 a Thai official came and held a meeting near our
monastery and told us that all the Dta La Ku people who have been staying
around here must go back to Burma because he said everyone trusts the
Dta La Ku, that the Dta La Ku can travel freely because the police never
rob or interrogate them. But then he said that the people who burned
down Huay Kaloke [refugee camp] were Dta La Ku, that the Dta La Ku
who are staying in Thailand now are spies for the SPDC and burned down
the [refugee] camps. I was so mad I wanted to hit him! I told him at
once: "Every Dta La Ku who lives in Thailand and Burma puts their name
on a list, and gives it to me once every year. Every Dta La Ku name is on
my list. If you say that the Dta La Ku attacked the camp then capture
those Dta La Ku and bring them to me. I will see whether they are real
Dta La Ku or fake Dta La Ku!" Then he said nothing. But I know that if
we do not live in the same place together, other people will try to destroy
our Dta La Ku culture. I know that the people who attacked Huay Kaloke
were not from around here. Maybe they were DKBA. There are some
DKBA who tie their hair in a knot and carry weapons. We don't like that.
There are some people who tie their hair in a knot and wear clothes like
ours who live in Thailand, in Maw Kwa and Paw T'Ga Hta. They drink
alcohol a lot. We don't like that either, because it destroys the name of
the
Dta La Ku who live here. I always think about these things. We are
good, but other people do not see us as good. They think that we are bad,
so we don't know what to do. We do good things but get bad in return,
and eventually we can't stand it anymore. I hope that the Thai, English
and
Burmese will think and have pity and do something for the Dta La Ku
people to be able to live together in one place. [Note: the attackers of
Huay Kaloke and the other camps were not disguised as Dta La Ku; the
Thai official was simply using disinformation to try to threaten the Dta La
Ku, which is a routine method of Thai officialdom.]
Q: Are there still some villagers in Kwih Lat Der village now?
A: Yes, some villagers still stay in Kwih Lat Der, Taung Ka Lay, Kay
Ghaw, Tee Ler Baw and Naw Po Heh. These villages are close to each
other. Now the KPA and the Burmese come there. There are no DKBA
now, but there are SPDC in Kwih Lat Der. They come and go, they don't
stay there all the time. Now they are #62 [Infantry Battalion]. Their
battalion commander is Than Win, and their company commander is
named Than Win also.
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- [END OF PART 5 - SEE SUBSEQUENT POSTINGS FOR PARTS 6 AND 7] -